Dr. Joel Aronowitz - All About CRNA’s Certified Registered Nurse Anesthesist (How to become one, what it’s like, etc!)
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| Dr. Joel Aronowitz |
Dr. Joel Aronowitz: “Hey, still have a mess. I took out a big breast cancer and did an immediate reconstruction, and I want to do a little video regarding anesthesia. Stephanie is one of the world's greatest nurse anesthetists, and you are a wonderful person. And I want to pick your brain a little bit for the benefit of those looking for a career in healthcare about being a nurse anesthetist, what the training is like and what some of the challenges are of actually being a nurse anesthetist. So first of all, what's the advantage or disadvantage of being an anesthesiologist and having an MD degree versus being a nurse anesthetist and having a CRNA degree?”
Stephanie Baker: “Well, I would say one of the major differences is that CRNAs have a nursing background. So we are best prepared nurses and we have to have at least one year to two years minimum experience in an ICU setting, whether that's cardiothoracic ICU, general ICU, pediatric ICU, whatever. Whereas anesthesiologist MDs go into medical school without any bedside experience, I would say. Well, it's not a requirement. It's not a requirement. Yeah. So I would say one of the major advantages of being a CRNA or going through a CRNA program is having the bedside nursing experience. Okay, that's good.”
Dr. Joel Aronowits “Absolutely. And is the length of the training longer or shorter, more rigorous, less rigorous? You know, that's a good question.”
Stephanie Baker: “You know, a bachelor program is four years, and then you have to do a year to two in the ICU. So it's another two years. And then anesthesia programs vary. My program is 30 months. I'm from Philadelphia. There are 24-month programs. There are 36-month programs. And now the programs are doctorate programs, whereas mine is a master's program. So they're a little bit longer. So it's probably pretty close. Probably eight years.”
Dr. Joel Aronowitz: “And an awkward question, but are you going to make more money or less money as a nurse anesthetist? Compared to an anesthesiologist MD. Compared to an MD anesthesiologist.”
Stephanie Baker: “Our salaries are less. Less, okay. You would say by half or 10% or?”
Dr. Joel Aronowitz: “That's a good question. I don't know what the anesthesiologist is. I think it's actually closer and closer.It depends on where you work as an anesthesiologist. So you can, traditionally I would say it's a good 30% less as a nurse anesthetist. That's probably fair. But now I think that number is getting closer together.
So now what about lifestyle? Is it something that's conducive to having outside interests a lot? Is it something you carry around all the time? You're worried about things?”
Stephanie Baker “'ll have to say this is my dream job. I'm so happy with the decision I made to become a CRNA. I love the schedule that it gives me. It's 10:30, and I'm done for the day. I'm going to go home and enjoy the California weather here. But you know what? This is just the nature of the practice that I work in. You can work in a hospital setting and work from 7 to 5, 3 or 4 days a week. It just varies on what kind of facility you live on.
Dr. Joel Aronowitz: “The sort of thing that you, I don't know if this is something that students and trainees think about, but it is a thing where as a surgeon, for example, I know myself and most surgeons carry things home with them. If you have a patient that you can't figure out the problem or there's a severe complication or just a tragic case, it's the sort of thing that you can't just let go of when you walk out the door. Is that a thing as a nurse anesthetist?”
Stephanie Baker: “I think similarly, like if we have a patient, we have a complication or something happened, of course, you carry that around with you. I always like to follow up with my patients.
Dr. Joel Aronowitz: “What's the worst complication that you've seen? I would say death. So people can die in the operating room.”
Stephanie Baker: “It's kind of the nature of the medical field is that you're going to have patients that you do everything you can for, and it's just sometimes.”
Dr. Joel Aronowitz: “And you have instances where you caused some problem. You made a judgment call that was wrong or that can happen, hopefully not too often.”
Stephanie Baker: “From what I've learned, I would say the important thing is to recognize if you've made a mistake.Or recognize a problem and try to figure it out with your team. Don't ignore it and be honest with yourself.”
Dr. Joel Aronowitz: “So now, how is it in the operating room when you're actually working. And you're over here operating all this complicated machinery and lots of dials and gauges and tubes and all kinds of things that people can't see but in that cart over there, there's about 300 different medications, and they all have a different dosage, and most of them can really hurt somebody badly if you give the wrong dose or you give the wrong medication at the wrong time. Is it a stressful job while you're doing it? Is it something where you're on the precipice all the time or you're just kind of easygoing?”
Stephanie Baker: “It can be very stressful, but I think that if you are vigilant and you prepare your case... I think anything unexpected.”
So now what about lifestyle? Is it something that's conducive to having outside interests a lot? Is it something you carry around all the time? You're worried about things?”
Stephanie Baker “'ll have to say this is my dream job. I'm so happy with the decision I made to become a CRNA. I love the schedule that it gives me. It's 10:30, and I'm done for the day. I'm going to go home and enjoy the California weather here. But you know what? This is just the nature of the practice that I work in. You can work in a hospital setting and work from 7 to 5, 3 or 4 days a week. It just varies on what kind of facility you live on.
Dr. Joel Aronowitz: “The sort of thing that you, I don't know if this is something that students and trainees think about, but it is a thing where as a surgeon, for example, I know myself and most surgeons carry things home with them. If you have a patient that you can't figure out the problem or there's a severe complication or just a tragic case, it's the sort of thing that you can't just let go of when you walk out the door. Is that a thing as a nurse anesthetist?”
Stephanie Baker: “I think similarly, like if we have a patient, we have a complication or something happened, of course, you carry that around with you. I always like to follow up with my patients.
Dr. Joel Aronowitz: “What's the worst complication that you've seen? I would say death. So people can die in the operating room.”
Stephanie Baker: “It's kind of the nature of the medical field is that you're going to have patients that you do everything you can for, and it's just sometimes.”
Dr. Joel Aronowitz: “And you have instances where you caused some problem. You made a judgment call that was wrong or that can happen, hopefully not too often.”
Stephanie Baker: “From what I've learned, I would say the important thing is to recognize if you've made a mistake.Or recognize a problem and try to figure it out with your team. Don't ignore it and be honest with yourself.”
Dr. Joel Aronowitz: “So now, how is it in the operating room when you're actually working. And you're over here operating all this complicated machinery and lots of dials and gauges and tubes and all kinds of things that people can't see but in that cart over there, there's about 300 different medications, and they all have a different dosage, and most of them can really hurt somebody badly if you give the wrong dose or you give the wrong medication at the wrong time. Is it a stressful job while you're doing it? Is it something where you're on the precipice all the time or you're just kind of easygoing?”
Stephanie Baker: “It can be very stressful, but I think that if you are vigilant and you prepare your case... I think anything unexpected.”
Dr. Joel Aronowitz: “Tell us something that actually happened.”
Stephanie Baker: “For example, if you're doing the laparoscopic cholecystectomy” and the surgeon puts the trocar through the abdominal aorta…”
Dr. Joel Aronowitz: “The trocar is a hollow tube that's sharp on the end or maybe trocar is solid and it's sharp so it can go into the belly.”
Stephanie Baker: “So he puts it in and it goes through the abdominal aorta.That was very stressful, and things got really busy”.
Dr. Joel Aronowitz: “The aorta is the largest blood vessel in the body, obviously. It takes about less than a minute to bleed to death from that.”
Stephanie Baker: “But luckily, you think of things…”
Dr. Joel Aronowitz: “And how did that turn out?”
Stephanie Baker: “She survived, and we got the gallbladder out. You have a plan A, B, and C and you try to think of the worst-case scenario. What can happen next? What's the next thing that can happen? Always be prepared, is what I would say.”
Dr. Joel Aronowitz: “What's the most satisfying or gratifying episode that you've had in recent days?”
Stephanie Baker: “When my patients make up happy and they just say thank you. Thank you, I was so scared to go to sleep. Thank you so much, you made this so easy. That just always makes me feel really good.”
Dr. Joel Aronowitz: ”Do you care if the surgeons say thank you?”
Stephanie Baker: “Yes, I do. Of course.”
Dr. Joel Aronowitz: “If you're actually having surgery, or you need surgery, or you're even having a colonoscopy or something screening like that, you're worried about anesthesia, you should know that whether it's an empty anesthesiologist or a nurse anesthetist, that these are individuals who take their role very, very seriously. If you get the impression that that person who's going to put you to sleep is not taking their role very, very seriously, you should say, "Stop, I don't want you taking care of me." There's nothing wrong with that. It's your body, and you have a right to tell people you want them to take care of you or somebody else. Fortunately, that is not necessary very often, and I'm very blessed that I have a nurse anesthetist and an empty anesthesiologist that I work with on a day-to-day basis. I appreciate them very much because their role is critical in allowing me to do what I need and want to do safely and making the experience not only safe but hopefully pleasant for the patient, so that I can accomplish the goal that I have for the surgery itself. I want to thank you for letting me interview you a little bit about this. I think the people that follow our channel really are interested in these, the other roles within the world of surgery that are open to them and want to learn something about it, so I really appreciate it.”
Stephanie Baker: “Anytime. Happy to help.”
Dr. Joel Aronowitz: “So, we will see you later Friday. Direct from Aronowitzland. Have a great day."
Stephanie Baker: “For example, if you're doing the laparoscopic cholecystectomy” and the surgeon puts the trocar through the abdominal aorta…”
Dr. Joel Aronowitz: “The trocar is a hollow tube that's sharp on the end or maybe trocar is solid and it's sharp so it can go into the belly.”
Stephanie Baker: “So he puts it in and it goes through the abdominal aorta.That was very stressful, and things got really busy”.
Dr. Joel Aronowitz: “The aorta is the largest blood vessel in the body, obviously. It takes about less than a minute to bleed to death from that.”
Stephanie Baker: “But luckily, you think of things…”
Dr. Joel Aronowitz: “And how did that turn out?”
Stephanie Baker: “She survived, and we got the gallbladder out. You have a plan A, B, and C and you try to think of the worst-case scenario. What can happen next? What's the next thing that can happen? Always be prepared, is what I would say.”
Dr. Joel Aronowitz: “What's the most satisfying or gratifying episode that you've had in recent days?”
Stephanie Baker: “When my patients make up happy and they just say thank you. Thank you, I was so scared to go to sleep. Thank you so much, you made this so easy. That just always makes me feel really good.”
Dr. Joel Aronowitz: ”Do you care if the surgeons say thank you?”
Stephanie Baker: “Yes, I do. Of course.”
Dr. Joel Aronowitz: “If you're actually having surgery, or you need surgery, or you're even having a colonoscopy or something screening like that, you're worried about anesthesia, you should know that whether it's an empty anesthesiologist or a nurse anesthetist, that these are individuals who take their role very, very seriously. If you get the impression that that person who's going to put you to sleep is not taking their role very, very seriously, you should say, "Stop, I don't want you taking care of me." There's nothing wrong with that. It's your body, and you have a right to tell people you want them to take care of you or somebody else. Fortunately, that is not necessary very often, and I'm very blessed that I have a nurse anesthetist and an empty anesthesiologist that I work with on a day-to-day basis. I appreciate them very much because their role is critical in allowing me to do what I need and want to do safely and making the experience not only safe but hopefully pleasant for the patient, so that I can accomplish the goal that I have for the surgery itself. I want to thank you for letting me interview you a little bit about this. I think the people that follow our channel really are interested in these, the other roles within the world of surgery that are open to them and want to learn something about it, so I really appreciate it.”
Stephanie Baker: “Anytime. Happy to help.”
Dr. Joel Aronowitz: “So, we will see you later Friday. Direct from Aronowitzland. Have a great day."
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